[johnhiler]

I think most developers who run highly trafficked websites will prefer keeping stuff out of the core, to minimize bloat and to maximize scaling. Whereas most casual webmasters running a smaller forum will want as much in the core as possible.

It’s a natural tension. I think the best way to split the difference is to keep the core lean and mean, and then to have a set of pre-packaged plugins that are included in the main download that can be turned on (or can even default to being on). I think WordPress experimented with this direction last year? Not sure where it ended up though.

A few things were moved out of bbPress plugins into core, and it hasn’t really gone that well. “Subscribe to topic” was added to the core, and then promptly had a problem with spammed topics being blasted out over email. It’s a lot easier to apply a patch to a plugin than it is to get the patch approved in the core.

The “Page Links for bbPress” plugin was also moved into the core in 1.0. There were a number of code inefficiencies in that code that are now locked into the core. There was a recent patch released for the plugin version of Page Links (only for 0.9) that fixed this; that’s an example of how it can be helpful to keep non-essential stuff out of core.

[_ck_]

As far as your question about bbpress as plugin, it’s going to be many many months before there’s an official release. If it’s done this year it certainly will be a fraction of what bbPress is currently (it’s nearly a complete rewrite).

Back to your cookie problem, keys are not the only issue. You have to make sure your cookie path in both bbPress and WordPress are the same, depending on where each are installed. There are a few integration topics about this, though bbPress has evolved to the point where you can change things more easily now.

[kevinjohngallagher]

This is an excellent point Matt, and actually one of the strong selling points of bbPress in the past 18months has been how little is in the core.

I, like i’m sure others out there, have had wrangles with moulding bbPress to work in the way I’d like (e.g. between 4-7 clicks to delete a user, and having to leave the admin area to do it, and not be able to do it in bulk = eek). But other than some core hacks (like adding actions / filters all over the shop), it can be modified quite nicely. I often describe bbPress as “90% there”. In part, down to the excellent base, and in large part to _ck_’s plugins.

That said, I feel that one of the issues with the current development line “we” kick started in December time is that we took 2 feautres which worked brialliantly as plugins and added them to the core; without any real need for that to happen.

Why? because they were features for the end-end user. Not the person running the forum. It’s like the people who say that people won’t post on their forums without a WYSIWYG editor or Smilies, we could add them to the core, loads of folks would be happy, but we’d still not be able to moderate all those nicely styled posts with loads of ” ZoMg >.<” etc

If you look at the features you’ve added to the core of WordPress, they rarely have been for the sole benfit of the person reading the blog. They’ve mostly been to benefit the person running the blog, in the theory that that enables the end-user too.

So reguardless of what version of bbPress/WordPress/other-software we’re talking about, even if somethings in the 80/20 split, please think who it benefits and who it causes issues for. We all know there’s good and bad to every decision, but let me assure you, i’m losing sleep over moderating a bbpress forum with anonymouse posting!

WP3.0 was effectively a “developer release”, or at least not end-end-user focussed. Not sure about you, but I think it’s the smoothest, least-buggy, most impressive release in a long long time. Maybe thats what bbPress needed instead of adding core features we already had as plugins.

Of course, hindsight, pretty wonderful thing.

[_ck_]

I greatly appreciate the consideration of using 2.0 instead of 1.2 which will at least slow down some confusion and make people realize the true weight of it as more than an update (and entirely different program).

I have to be honest though, I’ll probably be just going on my way once that plugin version is officially released to gold and the standalone versions become legacy.

You had a brilliant creation with 0.7, extremely lightweight and had the potential to be a pure framework and circumvent much of the legacy which shackles WP, but it’s all come full circle now and I simply cannot get behind such a radical reversion.

[kevinjohngallagher]

Dammit,

_ck_ I updated my plugin 2 weeks ago.

I’ll post it here in 20 when I’m home. I thought I’d put a download link on my website, but i must have bumped it with all the talking over the last week.

[johnnydoe]

as for me and for my usage, i need a fast and lightweight solution, so no blog front- and backend needed.

imho a better idea would be probably a pure and ultralight framework (let’s call it wp-cortex ) with an option to install a blog, a forum or both via plugins.

[Matt Mullenweg]

Probably what we will do is have the bbPress.org plugins section pull from plugins in the core WP directory with a certain tag, like how BuddyPress does it. We could probably keep the existing bbP directory running in a different directory to give people time to transition.

[Matt Mullenweg]

It should be even more seamless than it is now, possibly even included with the default BuddyPress package. (But I’ll defer to core BP people there.)

[jmharrington]

I was able to easily solve my issue by finding one careless mistake. In my wp-config.php file I simply copied the authentication keys (4 of them) and pasted them into my bbpress’s config.php file. What I did not notice is that in wp-config.php they keys are prefixed like this:

define(‘AUTH_KEY’,’my unique key is here’);

While in the bbpress config.php, the keys are prefix like this:

define( ‘BB_AUTH_KEY’,’my unique key is here’ );

The only difference is AUTH_KEY versus BB_AUTH_KEY, but that made the difference. Hope this helps technotip…

thanks _ck_ for emphasizing the auth keys

[Matt Mullenweg]

Not a bad idea. I’m hanging out on #bbpress if anyone wants to chat, but it’s unlikely I’ll be able to commit personally to any regular meetings this month or the next.

[Gautam Gupta]

I just had a suggestion – when the plugin would be public and this site’s posts converted, we could have an if statement above the topic like

if ( topic_date is before bla bla date || one of the topic_tags == 'bb_old' ) { /* load a message which says that this is for bb 1.1 and below, this doesn't apply to the new plugin */ }

But I’m also not against changing its name or having its version as 2.0.

[Matt Mullenweg]

I’ll ping Ben to see if we can’t get that on the site proper.

[Matt Mullenweg]

_ck_ maybe my tastes have changed? It’s not a perfect name but it does have historical significant and attachment for me. The integration will be the completion of the arc that started with my first checkin, because I felt the data structures of author-started versus user-started discussions were fundamentally different, and I could do it much faster on a DB structure just like minibb, which is what we used to use on WordPress.org and one of the first forums I really liked. (After attempting vBulletin and phpBB a number of times.)

We also have a history of major changes in 0.1 releases. We might indulge in a little bit of inflation with a 2.0.

I’ve been wondering that if addition to being part of the plugin directory for people already using WP, we could offer a pre-bundled download here on bbPress.org that could set up WP + bbP seamlessly so from a user experience point of view they’re still getting a “standalone” piece of software, just with a far more robust admin and update system. (Just a thought, we’ll figure it out when we get there.)

[Matt Mullenweg]

Here’s the link:

https://bbpress.org/blog/2010/07/wordpress-integration/

[_ck_]

It will take me a little while to find the original post but years ago you said you didn’t like the bbPress name.

If I can’t plead with you for a name change for a completely different forum program (it will likely share 10% or less of the original code) than at least don’t call it 1.2

1.2 has way too many implications that it’s a minor upgrade to 1.1 when in reality it’s a major overhaul (most especially if you aren’t running WordPress or WordPress 3).

All themes, plugins, hacks, advice will be invalidated.

That’s not a x.1 to x.2 update!

[_ck_]

Yeah problem was solved – sometime in the past week the code bug was fixed, I have no idea exactly when or by whom but was going to point it out until I tested it.

Unfortunately it did not clear up existing posts that were already html-entitied by the bug an example or two (but it even happened inside of backticks too)

I kinda don’t want to get into WP politics here (we’ve got enough of our own problems) but you can’t count downloads by existing users anymore who are terrified of being hacked because they didn’t keep up with the newest release.

I was looking into having some reindeer paraded by your door (10 “bucks” get it?) but I was afraid you’d BBQ them and send me a photo or something like that

[Matt Mullenweg]

I rather like the bbPress name. The reason TalkPress was registered for a hosted service was to avoid the confusion we have between WordPress.com and WordPress.org. (Which I would not repeat if given the opportunity.)

As I spelled out in roadmap discussions before, better integration with WordPress is the single most important item for the future of bbPress.

(Trimming the rest of this to turn into a blog post.)

[pastorbobsforum]

Hello.

How can I allow only certain members (or at least user types) to post images?

I am using the Allow Images (0.9) plugin on bbpress 1.0.2. The plugin is working fine, is just that I don’t want everyone to post his image, since I cannot afford it.

Thank you.

Regards,

Bob

[_ck_]

You know what, this idea grew on me, I like it and off to apply it.

It could be done a little fancier via the filters on bb_title and bb_get_title ie. the page could be injected between the forum name and the topic name, but this will do for now.

[Satish]

I will check out the cookie thing and post here again.

I am using WordPress 3.0 and bbpress 1.0.2, on a test site and I am facing the exact same problem as outlined by @jmharrington.

_ck_, I have another question, for which I don’t want to open another thread – because people may get annoyed.

I read this whole – “bbpress as standalone v/s plugin”, instead of understanding things, after some point of reading things, I got confused. I am so confused now to whether I need to wait till the plugin is released or can I go ahead and install present release? The problem is, I want to know – if I will be able to upgrade to plugin version later easily without loosing the current thread entries, users etc. ?

I tested almost all the forum software available and have settled with bbpress because its easy for users to understand and use.

[_ck_]

By the way, your site is using 69 queries on the front page, that is VERY very bad. Something is wrong. It’s probably not loading all your options at once and some other issues that 1.0 has.

You probably should be focusing on bb-benchmark instead of this plugin.

Also make sure you install this mini-plugin to try to reduce the queries:

https://bbpress.org/forums/topic/heres-how-to-fix-some-of-the-10-query-performance-regression

[kevinjohngallagher]

It’s a combo of SEO and HCI.

Having a different title for each page makes life easier for humans, as well as not being bad for SEO.

In the strictest sense, Google (et al) state that every page should have it’s own and unique title, and if relative should be linked with a canonical link.

(though, there is no doubt that they’re clever enough to work it out).

[stevan]

In fact someone once went as far as changing the whole structure to work like a blog

https://bbpress.org/forums/topic/bbblog-20-plugin

[Gautam Gupta]

This had been posted as a solution by _ck_ here – https://bbpress.org/forums/topic/bbpress-plugin-is-born/page/3#post-71233

[Erlend]

Is it too early to ask for a word on how the upcoming bbPress plugin will play in with BuddyPress?